148: Build Muscle & Gain Confidence Through Strength with Vegan Fitness Coach, Sarah Diederich

In this episode, I sit down with Sarah Diederich, a badass vegan fitness coach who helps women build strength, confidence, and muscles they didn’t even know they were capable of. We dive into why lifting weights is so important for women, especially if you’re rocking a plant-based lifestyle, and how you can build solid, beautiful muscle without ever touching animal protein.

Sarah walks me through her journey from academia to fitness coaching, and we get into the magic of personalized coaching, plus why nutrition and recovery matter just as much as the time you spend lifting. We also bust some myths about veganism and strength, talk about finding cardio that doesn’t make you want to scream, and geek out on stretching and mobility because your hips deserve love too.

Every woman can benefit from lifting and thriving on a vegan diet while crushing your fitness goals isn’t just possible, it’s empowering.

Helpful links

• Find VEGAINSARAH on Instagram @vegainsarah
• Drop It Club, our plant-fueled weight loss program
• The Clean Food Dirty Girl Facebook community

Transcript, auto-generated, may have errors

Molly Patrick: Hey there, this is Molly and thanks for tuning in to this week’s episode of the Clean Food Dirty Girl podcast. So today I’m talking with Sarah Diedrich and she is strong as f***. She is a… she lifts weights and she’s vegan and we have a lot of questions and a lot of ground to cover.

So I’ve been really wanting to talk with somebody who is really into bodybuilding, really into weightlifting, and also does not eat animal protein. And mainly because I want people to know that it’s possible to have really strong muscles and not eat meat. But I want to get into all of it. And as I was saying before we started, I posted this in our community, like, “Hey, what questions do you have for her?” And the feed just exploded. So we have so many questions.

So Sarah, thank you for taking the time to be here. And I just want to start, so I’m kind of obsessed with your Instagram. You have so much good information. You’re such a personality. And so I found this little snippet of yours and it’s, “Empower vegan and plant-based women to build muscle, confidence, and strength in a world that tells us to stay small.” So I think that’s such a beautiful message. So thank you for being here.

I’m going to give the floor to you to just kind of introduce yourself and say hi.

Sarah Diederich: Well, first off, thank you so much for having me. It’s a pleasure to be here. And yeah, so my name is Sarah. I am, as of this year, a full-time online vegan fitness coach for women. My primary goal is helping women, vegan women or even the curious women to actually become stronger, build muscle and break all the stereotypes that are because stereotypes still is women are weak, vegans are weak, and I’m trying to help them crush this.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, well, you’re doing an awesome job. You really come at it from a really entertaining and solid way. If, so you, and I love your Instagram handle. It’s V Gain, right? Like G-A-I-N, like Gain. And then what was the second part? Coach, V Gain Coach, or no, V Gain Sarah. Yeah.

Sarah Diederich: Exactly.

Sarah Diederich: It’s and Sarah. I thought I was going to be smart about making VG and then Sarah and was one of my brighter moments.

Molly Patrick: Very, very clever and we’ll link to all of that in the show notes as well. Okay, so can you just tell us a little bit about your background because you did not start off in the world that you’re currently in. You were taking a much different path and then you kind of did a whole kind of pivot. So can you talk a little bit about that just so we get a sense of your background and kind of how you got here?

Sarah Diederich: Absolutely. So I started off, as I said, in a very different direction. So I actually pursued two master’s degrees at university and followed up with one PhD. So I got my PhD in management. And during my PhD, I already knew that I wouldn’t want to stay in research because I didn’t kind of see my fulfillment there because you do your fancy statistics and all that stuff. I didn’t really see an impact.

In or during the time that I was doing my PhD, I turned vegan, I discovered the gym for myself. And so everything kind of fell into place because I realized at some point that this is really who I am as a person and this is what also spikes my interest. So I was at the end, probably reading more papers on fitness and nutrition than I was actually about my research topics, just because I got so curious about it. And I really saw the value and also the impact that it could have on other people by just living by example.

And also just helping people out. It might be the smallest things such as, I don’t know, how do I get my protein in as a vegan? Because that’s like such a huge topic still, unfortunately today that people do find it hard to hit their protein goals, especially if they want to lift weight. And so I took the, let’s say rather scary leap this year to decide to go to self-employment. Actually, I was working at a gym for two weeks. It was such a terrible experience because the boss was absolutely awful. And so in my two weeks, noticed,

Molly Patrick: Mm.

Sarah Diederich: two weeks. I after that, I was a little bit lost because I was like, “Hey, I’m out of a job again. I got a doctorate in management and now I’m out of a job and what am I going to do?” So that was when I decided that since I want to get into coaching anyways, I would just give it my all and yeah, that the leap and I am honestly, it was one of the best decisions I’ve made in the past years.

Molly Patrick: Well, congrats, congrats. Whenever somebody kind of follows where their heart takes them and they’re brave enough to take that leap, because it does require a lot of bravery and courage to do that, I’m always like cheering people on. I think, you know, it’s possible to make a living and make an impact and be way happier in what we’re doing than, you know, doing the thing that we kind of maybe were.

told to do or that we kind of thought we wanted at one point. And when you know you’re ready for a change and you can do that, I think it’s so inspiring. So even just by doing that, I think you are inspiring people. So many layers of your inspiration, Sarah.

Sarah Diederich: I hope so, thank you so much. But it kind of falls into place with my entire will to just do my own thing. Because like again, you said that there was a societal expectation maybe that after doing a PhD in management, you should get some fancy consultation or like job in a yeah as a consult or some advisor or just at university and I didn’t feel like myself and I just also maybe crushed some stereotypes there. So that’s I think I’ll make that my personality crushing stereotypes.

Molly Patrick: And so since you’ve made that switch, you like, is it working for you? Are you making it work? Are you kind of found your flow? Are you happy with your decision? I mean, it seems like you are, but just to have you talk about that.

Sarah Diederich: I’m 100% happy with my decision and it’s, I’m honestly baffled and beyond grateful for the support I’m getting also. And with all the clients that I’m already working with and the trust they put in me. And I just, I just feel so aligned with each and every one of my clients. And that is also, I think what makes me so happy in this job and also makes me hopefully a good coach because I just a hundred percent aligned with their values, with their goals, where they want to go. And so I can wholeheartedly say that this

has worked out exactly as I imagined. Of course, I kind of still need to find my flow with, I don’t know, content creation, then doing client stuff, doing this entire marketing stuff. So I do still need to figure out my schedule because right now it’s a little bit all over the place, but I’m doing just fine. So I’m really happy that happened.

Molly Patrick: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, finding a coach that you resonate with and who aligns with just talking from like a client perspective, if you can find a coach who you like, who you get along with and who, you know, has similar values, it’s really important. And I think, especially for us, you know, plant-based and vegan women, so many coaches out there.

you know, are not plant-based, do not even like really support that. A lot of them are men. You know, I think there’s a lot more men, I don’t know if this is true, but it seems like there’s a lot more men trainers out there than female trainers. So I’m sure that your clients, I’m sure that you’re a breath of fresh air because you have all that going for you and there’s such a niche for what you do. And I think that it’s just growing from what I see. So I think you’re gonna…

Sarah Diederich: Absolutely. And I like, as I say, there’s, there’s, I would say still more male coaches than female coaches, but there has been a shift and also there’s more and more vegan coaches. But again, it’s also very specific with the personality because in order to really have a good work with your client, you need to kind of get along with them. They need to get along with you because otherwise the accountability is just very different. So, yeah, I do hope that I can, can kind of convey my personality and also attract the right people. And so far it’s, it’s been happening.

Molly Patrick: You’re gonna, yeah.

Molly Patrick: Yeah.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, yeah. Well, you’re showing up as yourself. And I mean, and there’s a lot of different style of coaches, you know, like I’ve had coaches that are super kind of military boot camp. And I’m like, I can’t like my nervous system can’t handle that, like, because working out is hard enough. And like, I want somebody who’s going to push me, but also be like, kind of gentle and like nice. And, you know, so it’s like, you really do have to. And I have a weight loss program, plant powered, like weight loss program that I’ve run for the past year. And I talk a lot about.

getting stronger and lifting. I was coaching this woman the other day and I said she was thinking about getting a personal trainer and like, interview your trainers, go talk to a bunch of them and see which one is your style. So anyways, that just kind of falls into alignment with that. And I think it’s important that you find somebody that you’re comfortable with. So speaking of which, do you do like online clients or do you do just in person?

Sarah Diederich: I only do online clients actually. So they are also all over the place. So I don’t do anything in person, which is honestly for me perfect because I am super flexible both with my schedule, but also with the places that I want to be. So that is really cool.

Molly Patrick: Okay

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and just out of my curiosity, so when you meet with your client, do you tell them like, here’s the equipment that you need, here’s the space that you need, and you give them a list and then they have to like get that stuff together so that you can do it with them, like on Zoom or?

Sarah Diederich: No, no. So, like, I don’t work out with them in the sense that I kind of show them the movements that they have to do, but I put together a workout program for them. And I kind of put together a, like for the first 12 weeks, for example, that we work together, I put together a roadmap to work on other stuff than the gym, because obviously, lifting weights is not only about actually going to the gym or working out at home, but it is also about your nutrition, about your recovery, about maybe supplements that you need to take, especially on a vegan diet, for example.

Molly Patrick: Okay.

Molly Patrick: Hmm.

Sarah Diederich: And so there are so many more topics involved. So it’s more of a, let’s say holistic approach to it with the focus and emphasis obviously being on fitness and building muscle, but also the entire system that supports that. So they get a workout program from me depending on whether they work at the gym or at home and then based on their goals. So some want to be more strength focused, other want to be more hypertrophy focused. Some, I don’t know, can work out two times a week, the other ones can work out five times a week. So it’s all entirely based around them and how to fit.

fitness into their lifestyle because I think that’s what’s actually all about. Like how can I fit fitness and building muscle and becoming strong into a very busy life of a single mom for example as compared to how can I do it with someone that is currently studying.

Molly Patrick: Mmm.

Molly Patrick: Okay. And so because of this, was just, I go to like a weightlifting class a couple of times, two to three times a week. And so, and it’s a, it’s a group fitness class and I really like my coach and we were talking, she was just in Poland for like this past month and she was like, “I didn’t get to the gym. So I was doing a lot of workouts just in my room, just using my body weight.” And so I know that there’s, mean, there’s so many ranges of exercises and ways that you can build muscle and lift and.

I imagine then if you’re doing this, then people can expect the movements to not be that like complicated and they don’t necessarily have to be that complicated then.

Sarah Diederich: Absolutely not. So depending on their level of experience also at the gym or with weightlifting in general, you can of course program a complex movement, but I would never go ahead and give the most complex and weirdest compound movements to a beginner because what’s the point in that? And that’s also the beauty about weightlifting and building muscle. You don’t have to do any single exercise. There are for each muscle group so many different exercises you can do. They can also adapt it to the preferences of the clients and also to their…

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: coordination abilities, for example.

Molly Patrick: Right, interesting. It’s like a whole world. It’s a whole, whole world. So yeah, this is good. So I’m gonna open up a bunch of these questions now, because I wanna dive into this, because I really wanna have time for like most of them, because they are, there’s a lot of good ones here. So, okay. This is from Jill. She says, “I know to lift heavy, but what is the most effective strength training routine moves?”

“You recommend for peri-postmenopausal women, whether for weight loss or to keep those muscles and bones healthy and strong.”

Sarah Diederich: So she’s asking about specific exercises, if I get it correctly.

Molly Patrick: Specific exercises for peri and postmenopausal women specifically to keep muscles and bones healthy and strong. The most effective strength training routine slash moves.

Sarah Diederich: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: Okay, so generally I’d say compact moves are always a good way to go. Because if it’s, let’s say mostly about sustaining muscle mass and staying healthy, having healthy bones, heavy compact moves like for example squats are a great idea or deadlifts where you engage a lot of your muscles and it’s not very isolated because the oscillation movements are rather also for hypertrophy, so more for aesthetic reasons for example.

So if you really want to want to stay strong, it doesn’t really matter, let’s say, in what phase of your age also you’re in. So whether you’re perimonopausal or just someone that starts off, you should always actually do compound moves and just always lift heavy, let’s say. And then it also comes to your preferences and your abilities. So obviously, if you have some specific symptoms that come along with your with your perimonopausal phase, for example, then of course you can alleviate these symptoms by, for example, just not doing certain exercise. Let’s say

Molly Patrick: Mmm.

Sarah Diederich: you have experienced with lower back pain, for example, ever since you’re in perimenopause, then okay, maybe don’t do that lift spot, do something that will put less stress on your lower back, for example, do a hamstring curl, that would be a rather isolation exercise spot, or dumbbell lunges backwards, for example. So really, compound moves should be the essence of your workouts.

And then when it comes to routine, really depends on how many days a week you can lift. So I always say if you can lift three times a week, you should do a full body composition. Let’s say you have a three day split that is just full body every day. And because every muscle group should be trained either twice to three times a week.

But as soon as you lift weights more than four times or at least four times a week, you should have some kind of a split like, for example, upper-lower or push-pull legs, for example, in order to also give your muscles enough recovery to actually recover from each session. And I think that becomes even more important as we also age to really give us that recovery time between sessions. So I would really put a lot of emphasis on the recovery as well.

Molly Patrick: Okay, so let’s talk about the recovery then. Do you suggest for that recovery time?

Sarah Diederich: So generally it’s sad that depending on your level of experience, you need at least 24 to 72 hours to recover between sessions. Usually the 24 hours are really rather for advanced people. So I always also with my clients suggest that they take off two to even three days between hitting the same muscle group twice. So let’s say for example, you had upper body on Monday, then you should wait at least until Wednesday until you hit upper body again, but actually until Thursday, because our muscle just needs time to kind of repair the.

Molly Patrick: Okay.

Sarah Diederich: the damages that we’ve done to it and we also want to get post that point of fatigue because if you train your muscles too fast after your muscles are still fatigued and you won’t be able to lift as heavy because they haven’t recovered yet from that heavy lifting session the day before and if you want to really progress and also build muscle then it’s really necessary that we kind of get above that fatigue and kind of peak again in our muscle performance and then we can have heavy weights again. So recovery between sessions should always likely be two to three days optimally.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and so you were talking about compound exercises. Can you explain what that is?

Sarah Diederich: Oh yeah, sorry, sorry. I’m in such a bubble that it kind of makes sense for me. Compound movements are movements that involve multiple muscles at once so that are not isolated. So for example, if you think of a bicep curl, that is an isolated exercise because it only involves the bicep. But if you think of a squat, for example, that is a compound move because many muscle groups are involved. You have quads that are involved, your hamstrings, your glutes, your lower back, your core, because you have a lot of stability going on.

Molly Patrick: No, no, it’s okay. Yeah.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: So that would be compound movement or for example, a bench press or a chest press because obviously you have your pecs involved, have a tricep, your shoulder involved. So common movements basically are any movements that involve a bunch of muscles and not just one very specific type of muscle.

Molly Patrick: Got you, okay, yes, that makes sense. So, all right, so this is what you, and I like what you said, like, it doesn’t matter kind of where you are in your life, like, that’s really important to start off with anyways. And we’re gonna get a lot of questions about menopause and post-menopause and perimenopause just because there’s a lot of people in our community who are at that kind of age. And so I am like, we can talk about more about that later once we get to some of these questions, but I think that it is,

Sarah Diederich: Exactly.

Molly Patrick: interesting that you said, “Hey, you know, doesn’t matter where you’re at, what age you are. These are still really important no matter what age.”

Sarah Diederich: Exactly. It’s always very individual. I mean, for example, if you have, for example, had three kids, let’s say, then obviously it might be that your pelvic floor is a little bit weaker and I might not want you to do squat jumps, for example, because you might be leaking literally. So it really is very dependent on your own experience and on your own, let’s say, restrictions that you also have. There’s no, to the best of my knowledge, no scientific evidence that points that towards, I don’t know.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: some wrap range or some specific exercises being better for a certain age group than for another. Just as much as there’s no scientific evidence to this point that shows that you should do something like cycle thinking in the sense that, I don’t know, in your luteal phase, you should have your cardio, in your follicular phase, you shouldn’t do weightlifting. So that is kind of also maybe an issue because there hasn’t been a lot of research on that yet. There is still research is lacking behind on weightlifting insights when it comes to women because…

We have been relatively new to the sport, let’s say, and it’s only increasing as we speak, hopefully.

Molly Patrick: Yes, yes, yeah. Okay, that’s great. The next question is, this might be the same question. “What does she suggest for postmenopausal women? I have a hard time building muscle after menopause.” So you kind of already covered that, but if somebody came to you and was like, “Menopause is over and I can’t build muscle.”

Sarah Diederich: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: So I think the very first thing that I actually always check is nutrition, because I think a lot of people underestimate the relevance of nutrition when it comes to building muscle, especially also, let’s say, women that are above a certain age might often neglect protein, for example. And I know the protein talk is so, so, so, so, so, so old, but it is something that where only the awareness has been coming around, let’s say, in the past few years, also especially amongst younger people.

Molly Patrick: “Or I have a hard time building muscle, what would you say?”

Sarah Diederich: So that is the first thing that I check in. How is your nutrition? How is your recovery? Because obviously it also changes after menopause that your recovery might just not be as good because you don’t sleep as well. For example, your hormones are maybe a little bit, you know, all over the place, but based on, say your hormones that you still have available based on everything that you have available in your body, there’s no reason why you shouldn’t be able to build muscle. So basically it really comes back to…

Molly Patrick: Okay, so yeah.

Sarah Diederich: do the basic, do the fundamentals, build muscle, have your protein or your nutrition in general and check also your carbs, your fats. So all of that is very, very important. Also for our hormonal health, like fats are super underestimated, for example. So really check all of the basics out. And if it still doesn’t work for you, then I would maybe consult with a doctor to see whether something might be off also in terms of hormones that might impact your performance in some way.

Molly Patrick: Okay. Yeah. And I think we’ll kind of circle back to nutrition as we go through this conversation, because there’s more about that as well. And I think one thing that you said is like, fats are really important for, did you say for building muscle? Is that what you said? For hormonal health. Okay. And what’s interesting is that, so what we do in Clean Food, Dirty Girl in our community, we really advocate the whole food plant-based diet, which is, you know, focusing on

Sarah Diederich: For Hormone

Molly Patrick: whole foods, veggies, fruits, beans and legumes, nuts and seeds, whole grains. And I think that there are people in that community who advocate for less fat. And then there’s people in that community who advocate for a little bit more fat. So that kind of debate within the whole food plant-based community is there is one. And so, and I kind of always fall in like the middle roads, like, “Okay,”

“You need some fat, like don’t overdo it, right? Just kind of incorporate a wide range of whole plant foods, including avocados and some nuts and seeds and some olives, et cetera.” And so I think maybe, I mean, if you were to have a client who’s like, “I’m whole food plant-based and I’m eating very, very low fat,” that might be something you would want to look at, especially in that age of like, we’re going through hormonal changes.

Sarah Diederich: Absolutely. And I would also recommend, for example, if they don’t already supplement it or get their omega-3 in, but especially the longer-chain fatty acids. So when it comes to omega-3, we have ALA, which is mostly contained in nuts and seed, for example, but the longer chain, so EPA and DHA, for example,

they are in algae and seaweed. And that is something that a lot of plant-based or vegan people are actually maybe not deficient in, but don’t get in enough because we don’t eat a lot of these products. So there, for example, I would recommend that you might also take an Omega-3 supplement from algae oil to really also support your health there because the long-chain fatty acids, Omega-3 fatty acids can really also sometimes already reduce inflammation and symptoms that you might have.

for example, your period, for example. So that might already help to really check out, your nutrition really again in check?

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. And for, I know that the supplement that I really like and like one of the only ones I take is the, it’s called, it’s by Complement, that company, and it’s their essential. And it’s, if you take it and you have an aftertaste of like kind of like algae, that’s what it is because they use algae for those fatty acids. So I can put a link to that as well in the show notes, but is there a particular supplement that you take and you like and you trust?

Sarah Diederich: So I take a like a multivitamin that contains B12, vitamin D3, K2, but it also has like magnesium in there, selenium, zinc, so it just basically covers everything. It is not necessary to be honest. And I supplement omega-3 myself also from Algalda, but that’s a different supplement. It covers more than the essential, it’s essential, let’s say, but I want to make sure that I really don’t miss out on anything.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: But I guess something I would recommend every vegan obviously is B12. If you don’t live on a sunny beach all year round, it would be also vitamin D. And then also omega-3 is really a big one. But I myself just take a multisupplement and I’m good with that.

Molly Patrick: Okay, yeah, and even if you, like I live in Hawaii, I live on Maui, so it is sunny year round, but I still supplement with vitamin D because I have very fair skin, so when I go outside, I’m like covering up, putting on clothes and sunscreen and all of this, so I’m always advocating that too. Get your vitamin D levels checked at your doctor just to make sure you don’t need to supplement with those. And I think a lot of people do. Even if they live in a place that’s relatively sunny just because of the nature of the…

how intense and dangerous too much sun exposure can be or is. Okay, so the next question is, “I’m 54 and I’ve been strength training, lifting heavy weights for almost two years. All of my trainers keep telling me I’m not eating enough protein to build the muscles I’m working each day. How would you respond to that? What do you focus on to fit with your body building lifestyle?”

Sarah Diederich: So the amount of protein that is recommended is like the recommended amount for you to actually really build muscle is 1.6 to two grams of protein per kilogram of body weight. However, what I see a lot of coaches do is that they actually really overshoot it and they always recommend to hit like two grams of protein per kilogram of body weight or even above that, which is completely not necessary. So there’s no statistical difference between you hitting 1.6 to or

two grams of protein per kilogram of body weight. So first thing that I would say, maybe you can tell a little bit about it because I think there’s like this huge hyper-rode protein and yes, it is important and especially on the vegan diet it is or on plant-based diet, it is very often a subject that people also maybe struggle a little bit with. Aim for 1.6 gram of protein per kilogram of body weight and you’re fine with that. So don’t really overdo it because that’s not really necessary.

Molly Patrick: Hmm.

Sarah Diederich: And so the way I also fit into my lifestyle is really including high quality protein sources. So not only getting my protein from legumes and beans, but also including high protein sources like tempeh, seitan, tofu, in pretty much all of my meals, at least into two out of my three meals a day.

Molly Patrick: Okay.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and so the 1.6 is for if you are building muscle, like if you are working out and building muscle. And so can we just do some math really quick because, and maybe I can get my phone out because, or maybe you have it off the top of your head. So if you were somebody who, your healthy body weight is like 140 pounds, right? So I guess I’d have to do 140 pounds to kilograms, just to get, just so that people have like a rough,

Sarah Diederich: Exactly. Yeah. Exactly.

Molly Patrick: cents. I’m going to just do this really quick. 140 pounds.

Sarah Diederich: should be something around 64, 65 probably. I’m very bad at this conversion. Okay.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, 63, 63. So 63 times, okay, 63 times 1.6, which is 100.

Sarah Diederich: Yeah.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and so, and what you’re saying is anything more than that, you probably don’t need. Okay.

Sarah Diederich: you don’t really have a benefit from it. You can go up to two grams of protein per kilogram of body weight, but there’s no difference that is noticeable in research, like in terms of statistical significance, whether you ingest 1.6 or two grams of protein. So why bother going through the pain of really chugging down some protein if you could just fill it up with more extra carbs that give you some more extra energy.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, yeah, and I think that the important thing there is looking at your meals as, you know, every meal is an opportunity to get in the nutrition, right? Not only the macronutrients, but also the micronutrients that are really important. But so if you are aiming for 100 grams a day, like I’ve done the math on this and I’ve been like, “Okay, here’s examples of, you know, a day of eating that would provide you with 100 grams and it is doable.”

“You just do really have to focus on those higher protein foods at every meal.”

Sarah Diederich: Exactly. Yeah, exactly. So I do that with some of my clients as well that just struggle to get their protein in and their goal for the day then is just also to include a high quality protein source into two of their three meals. And that means just adding, I don’t know, adding some tofu in there, adding some temper in there or lupini beans, for example, also a great source of protein or ademama beans, whatever it is, and really make the protein source then the center of your meal. And if you do that with two meals, sometimes even one,

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: you are good to go because you will fill the rest with like all the legumes and beans that you eat and also with the carb sources. So that is something that is often neglected. Even if you eat rice, which is a carb source, you still get some protein from that. So if you really kind of have two meals that are centered around protein, you’ll easily cover the rest with anything else you eat.

Molly Patrick: And so the ones that you really recommend are like tempeh, tofu, like soy products. And you also said seitan as well, because I know that seitan is really high in protein. Yeah.

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, exactly. Stay-Town and then also PTVP for example, just soy or PTVP, but if you don’t want to ingest soy, then P is a good option as well. And Lupini beans, also great. Lupini beans, they are not that known, but they’re also not available everywhere. So for example, in Germany, I don’t get them, but here in France, I do get them easily in every supermarket.

Molly Patrick: Uh-huh. What kind of beans?

aloo peene beans.

Sarah Diederich: You have to like to taste, they’re a little bit bitter, but they’re actually also great protein.

Molly Patrick: Lupini beans. Okay, I’ve had them. I have never had them in the US, but I’ve had them in Europe. Yeah, so maybe you can order them here, but that’s great to know, because yeah, that’s not a common one here. Okay, fabulous. So that answers that. The next question is, “What is your take on protein shakes?” So let’s just start with that one, because she has a few questions.

Sarah Diederich: Honestly, great. I have nothing against them. I use them myself. It can just be very convenient. So I think the problem is that shakes or protein powders or whatever it is often demonized because they are like processed and maybe not, know, the best source in terms of that. Also don’t give you that as many fiber, for example, as like, I don’t know, lentils would, for example. But if it makes your life easier, absolutely go for it. And there are so many good options out there nowadays that are organic, that are

without any artificial sweetness because that gives a lot of people bloating for example and there are so many options, absolutely go for it. So yeah, obviously the bulk of your protein should still come from a whole food diet or from just your general meals let’s say, but if you need a shake to fill that up, make your life easy, don’t worry about it.

Molly Patrick: Okay, that’s great. And I just saw a study that came out showing that a lot of protein powders were testing for high amounts of lead. Have you heard, did you read that?

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, that is a US thing though. Yeah, also, you also have brands that check for that. So for example, I will actually start working with a brand which I now want name in December as well that is US based and they just regularly have their batches checked, for example. So there are brands that just include that regularly in their protocol for their product quality that they get it checked anyways.

Molly Patrick: That’s U.S. go right of course because there’s a lot of stuff that you don’t find in Europe that we have here in the U.S.

Molly Patrick: Yes.

Sarah Diederich: those are usually also not concerned by these kind of scandals, let’s say. So if you want to be on the safe side, go for a brand that actually also checks their product once in while.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Molly Patrick: Yep, and that’s another reason why I do like the compliment brand because they do, like they really check their products and they use like a third party to do it. So they’re not like doing it themselves, which is really important. So I think, you know, just make sure that you have, you know, you get one that you trust for all of those people out there wanting to incorporate that. Okay, so the next question is, “Okay, this is the same person.”

Sarah Diederich: Exactly.

Molly Patrick: “What volume of food do you eat at each meal?”

Sarah Diederich: Does she mean by volume the sizes of my meals? It really depends and I also don’t, like I usually refrain a little bit from telling people too much about what I eat. So I do post recipes or my food that have like full lunch so that they see one meal, but I never show people what I eat an entire day, for example, because I don’t want people to kind of take an example of me. And then it really depends if I have something like a yogurt, for example.

Molly Patrick: I think so.

Sarah Diederich: that will be a smaller bowl than if I have, for example, a quinoa salad, because obviously just the volume is already a little bit bigger if I have a salad, I need to eat more in order to get enough nutrients in. So it really depends. But what I actually like to do is roughly eyeball. I do like the hand method, for example. So where you have like one palm of protein and then like one cup of carbs and then one fist of veggies, for example. So that is kind of a good way to start it off.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: But there’s no specific amount of volume that I eat, because it also really depends on my day. If I’m super hungry, if I hadn’t had a proper lunch, for example, because I was super stressed out, then my dinner will obviously be a little bit bigger. So it varies immensely.

Molly Patrick: Yes, okay. So I like that there’s not one set goal that you’re going for because I mean, like you say, it totally depends on the day and how much energy we’re using and what our schedule is like and what we ate for breakfast. So it sounds like you are in tune with your body and what it needs at any given meal.

Sarah Diederich: Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So I also don’t track calories or macros or haven’t in years because I just learned how to to actually listen to my body and how to fuel my body, you know properly without having to track everything. But of course, I also do have to say that I have like a fair amount of knowledge when it comes to how much I’m roughly getting in. So I do know if I want my food. Okay, there’s roughly I don’t know 35 to 40 grams of protein in there. So I’m good for example. So that’s a skill that you course have to learn but otherwise.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: don’t overthink it just yeah, if you live in tune with your body, that’s totally fine and that can work perfectly.

Molly Patrick: Okay, let’s see. This very, okay. So she was asking about competing and you don’t compete. You just, I heard you say you don’t compete. You just like to lift heavy shit. So yes, so I love that. So she also wants to know what questions do you get about, okay, what?

Sarah Diederich: Exactly.

Molly Patrick: Sorry, what questions about being vegan do you get asked most often? Yeah, she says there’s a lot of interesting things to ask. In this world that you’re in, are there a lot of other vegan bodybuilders that you know who are really liking to lift heavy shit? Or are they mainly like people who aren’t and just have a lot of questions for you?

Sarah Diederich: So I am very much in a bubble, have to say. So in my perception, I know a shitload of vegan weightlifters, vegan powerlifters, vegan bodybuilders, but I know that in the grand scheme of things, they are probably fairly invisible. However, I also have to say that Instagram or social media in general just has really widened my view of people because I am able to connect with so many people all over the world. But if I just looked at my private life.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Mm.

Sarah Diederich: I think I know two vegans apart from myself. So it’s really not a lot of people. So in real life, only know like two vegans apart from myself. And obviously, they are also not like the typical, well, let’s say, because the intersection of vegans and weightlifters is just very, very small. So but yeah, the bubble is growing. Obviously, they’re also like these typical, let’s say,

Molly Patrick: to sync, yeah.

Sarah Diederich: stupid questions from non-vegans, non plant-based people that live heavy shit and they are just as surprised again about for example the protein because they have that very bad misconception that vegan protein is hard to get or that it’s inferior or whatever it is. So that is a very typical question but fortunately I’m kind of in my bubble so I’m kind of out of touch with these kind of questions mostly.

Molly Patrick: Yes, okay, yeah, that makes sense. And the whole, yeah, so there’s like two things, right? Either people are thinking that you can’t get enough protein on a vegan diet when you’re lifting or that it’s not quality protein and that you really need animal protein in order to build muscles. So can you just flex your bicep for us real quick just so that we can, okay, yeah.

Sarah Diederich: Delighting is God though.

Molly Patrick: It’s like, okay, so this is, no, we get it. So this is muscle that you have built by fueling with plants. There’s no evidence out there that you need animal-based protein to be strong. There’s just not, and it’s amazing how many people are out there who really tout that and who really truly believe that.

Sarah Diederich: Absolutely.

Molly Patrick: And especially with social media, it spreads, that kind of information spreads. And so let’s just like look at Sarah’s body and just say, “No, it’s possible. You don’t need me to do this.”

Sarah Diederich: Thanks

Sarah Diederich: Yeah. And then something that people or fit vegans also very often hear is that, you build all of that muscle eating meat and now you went vegan and you’re like, “Yeah, look at me.” And I’m like, “No, I started weightlifting when I was vegan. So that didn’t happen with meat.” And I was vegetarian way prior to that, so over a decade. So I haven’t had meat in a very, very long time. And then it was like a little bit of dairy and stuff. But I started lifting when I went vegan.

Molly Patrick: Right.

Sarah Diederich: It is, as I say, it’s really frustrating because at this point you might think that people are finally aware that you don’t need animal protein, especially because also the research on it is so clear at this point. And there’s so much research coming out showing that there’s no difference in strength gain or in muscle mass gain, for example, if you have lifters that are on a plant based diet compared to lifters that are on an omnivorous diet. And still people believe all of that nonsense because there are some carnivore yuppers out there that just spread a nonsense and

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: It is really infuriating. But then again, I also can’t really blame people because it is very hard to differentiate BS information from actual information and to differentiate or a lot of people also don’t get a nuance between anecdotal evidence versus factual evidence or scientific evidence. So yeah, even my vegan bicep is like, you know, it’s anecdotal evidence, but there is also scientific evidence, of course, that you can belt mussels as vegan. I don’t get it. I really don’t get how people still believe all that nonsense.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Right.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, yeah. It’s a big, I think it’s like been baked in, right? Like it’s like the societal narrative that’s baked into us. And we get that in really subtle messages from the time we’re little. I mean, I grew up without eating meat. I’ve never eaten meat in my life. You know, that was, I mean, for the eighties, that was really, really unheard of. And I grew up.

all the time. Like so many people in my life, like just relatives and people not really in my like parent circle, like, “You need to go see a doctor, you’re not going to be healthy, you’re not going to be strong enough, you’re not going to grow tall.” And, you know, again, anecdotal, but like, I’ve been healthy my whole life. And so but it is I mean, that message really, I think we’re combating a lot of things when we are able to.

get out of that noise, we really have to choose to do it because if we just go with what people are saying, it’s very easy to get into that trap of thinking that that is true when it’s really not.

Sarah Diederich: Absolutely. I think it’s also a bit of a, or maybe the fault of dietary guidelines in some countries. So I don’t know how exactly it is in US, but for example, if I look at the German dietary guidelines, when they recommend protein and the amount of protein that you should ingest based on your age, gender, your activity levels, when they give examples for protein, they are mostly, you know, animal based and there’s only very few, let’s say plant based foods in there and then they will hit you with

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, with lentils and beans, for example, yes, they do contain a fair amount of protein, but they are not like the highest quality protein sources or not highest quality, but the highest protein source that we have out there because for example, tempeh is way more dense protein than lentils, for example. So I think also that the dietary guidelines in the countries could maybe catch up on that a little bit.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, and those, at least here in the US, there is the beef lobby and the poultry lobbies that they’re working against. It’s just such a, that’s a lot. I don’t, yeah, I see the changes that people are making. They’re making because it’s like coming from.

you know, other people sharing information and being an example, it’s definitely not coming from the government saying like eat more tempeh and less beef, for example. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So let’s see. “What are your favorite recipes for pre and post workout?” And then there’s another kind of cute question. So yeah, let’s talk about this pre and post workout. This is interesting. What do you, what do you say about that?

Sarah Diederich: So it depends. Usually like here I have a very different schedule. So I’ll just have my regular breakfast actually before workout and then I’ll wait for a few hours and I’ll hit the gym. But usually when I’m at home, I go to the gym insanely early in the morning. So my pre-workout would be some cream of rice, sometimes some protein powder in there or just some EAAs, but mostly just cream of rice, protein powder, some berries on top. And then I’m good to go. So basically I’m getting in carbs that are easier to digestible because I need the energy for my workout.

and some protein to also kind of have the amino acids readily available. And since I usually then eat very shortly before my workout, I also don’t include fats because they are just, you know, slowly digested. So I don’t kind of want that too much. And then after my workout, I just have a regular meal that contains carbs, protein, fats, everything you have. That could be a yogurt bowl with some oats and some protein powder in there and some fruits in there, for example, or

tofu scramble on bread with cucumber for example so really just covering all the macros afterwards but most important obviously after the workout is both carbs and proteins so they are always included.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and how, like when do you eat after you workout? Do you like workout? Is there a certain amount of time that you wait to eat? Or do eat right away after?

Sarah Diederich: Usually I’m very hungry after my workouts anyway, so I just get home and I eat. And there’s also not like a specific window. I know that there’s this anabolic window that everyone keeps talking about that if you don’t have your protein shake within like, I don’t know, 30 or 60 minutes after your workout, you know, all of your gains will be lost, which is absolute nonsense. So as long as you get your, your carbs, protein in after the day or in the entire day, everything’s fine. So just see through it that you fill up your glycogen storage, see through it that you get your amino acids in and your protein in and then you’re to go.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Okay.

Sarah Diederich: So again, I think it’s a personal preference. Some people after a workout are just not that hungry and they need to wait for an hour. That’s fine.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. I love it. It’s not over complicated. I like it. Here’s the question. “What foods make you happy?”

Hehehehehe

Sarah Diederich: There are so many. I’m such a foodie. And I think I’m very basic, probably with this, but a good tofu scramble. Like give me a good tofu scramble and I’m absolutely sold. So that’s really something I enjoy. I always put it on bread and with some veg spread and cucumbers, that really makes me happy. But there’s so much like, I really love the Asian cuisine. So for example, I had to compare tofu with veggies and rice. So it’s really…

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

you

Sarah Diederich: It’s really hard to tell because I’m not a picky eater at all and I just genuinely love food and a variety of foods.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That’s the same thing with me. I’m like if it’s um plant-based then like I’m I’m all about it So and there’s so many I mean there’s so much to choose from But a good tofu scramble. I’m with you on that. There’s That’s just one of the things that really hits the spot and it can be so versatile you can add lots of different spices and different you can have it like be an Italian touch or like a Southeast Asian touch or like You know, there’s so many different ways to go with it and you can put so many veggies in it and Yeah

Sarah Diederich: Exactly.

Sarah Diederich: It’s the best.

Molly Patrick: I agree. I’m a big fan. Okay, let’s see. What is… no. Post-workout snack. We already looked at that. And, “So what is your optimal fiber target?”

Sarah Diederich: Again, I don’t track, I don’t really worry about my fiber to be honest, because as a vegan you usually get in enough of it. So I would always recommend to people to get like 25 to 30 grams of fiber in a day at minimum. But again, it also depends on how well you digest it. So some people will just bloat a lot from fiber. So maybe then we could kind of try to reduce a little bit because again, as plant based people, as vegans, we usually don’t lack in fiber. So sometimes it

could really help even to reduce fiber and maybe for example, go away from very cruciferous veggies for example that might cause a lot of bloating. So again, it depends on your individual experience. I don’t have any issues with bloating or digestion or whatever. So I just eat pretty much whatever. So again, I’m very much just listening to my body and what my body tells me specifically.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. And do you find for people, have you had experienced people who do get bloated from cruciferous veggies and if you cook or steam them the bloating is less so?

Sarah Diederich: I haven’t had any personal experience with that, or like clients that had these issues. I know that my own coach, for example, he has a lot of issues with legumes, for example. So what helps for him is that he sprouts those, for example, and then it’s better, or that he uses fermented legumes. So for example, tempeh for him works better than, yeah, some like the Dura ademama bean, for example. So sprouting and really fermenting can help a lot.

Molly Patrick: Okay. Okay.

Molly Patrick: Mm.

Molly Patrick: Okay.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. And do you find that people who do have some digestion reactions to fiber, do you find that these are people who typically they’re new to this way of eating and their microbiome and their gut haven’t had the time to adjust to these fibers?

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, so it’s often actually people that start living a plant-based diet that they just overdo it and that they kind of think, “Okay, now that I’m eating no meat anymore, no dairy, I need to eat so much more volume because otherwise I’m not going to get in enough calories.” So what they eat is like a crazy amount, like, I don’t know, 500 grams of broccoli in one sitting. Like, yeah, okay, but then I’m not really surprised that you encountering issues because you kind of have to slowly introduce it. So that’s a common issue indeed.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Hmm.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: People that have been on a plant-based diet for a long time. I have personally never met someone that has any issues with, know, digesting fiber or like bloating.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Okay, good to know for people who, yeah, we get people who are new to this and it’s like, you know, making sure that you, I’ve had and worked with people who was like, “Okay, I can’t eat raw kale or cabbage.” I’m like, “Okay, steam it, make sure you steam it.” And they’re able to do that easier. You know, soaking beans, sprouting beans, that’s a good one. Cooking beans with some wakame seaweed or kombu seaweed.

can be really good. So there are those little tricks to do that. And so I would suggest that if anybody is experiencing that, don’t give up and just cut back and make sure that you are preparing those fibrous foods in a way that’s gonna be gentle on your system.

Sarah Diederich: And also just because I didn’t know about steaming, but something that just came to my mind is that just raw is also harder on the body than if you, as I said, steam it or cook it or just pan fry it even. But eating too many raw veggies can also be very hard on the gut. So maybe also go a little bit slower on the carrots that you dip in your hummus, for example.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Right, and put all those carrots in a delicious soup, right, with like a big veggie soup. Okay, let’s see. Let’s see, I’m gonna try to make sense of this question. “Is your protein target closer to the bodybuilding recommendations, roughly one gram per pound per kilogram,” she’s talking about, “or closer to what whole food plant-based doctors recommend?” And we talked about that, right? Most plant-based…

Sarah Diederich: Yep, yep.

Molly Patrick: Whole Food Plant-Based Doctors, RECBEN 0.8, and what you’re seeing is 1.6 for people who are building muscle. So that is pretty clear.

Sarah Diederich: Exactly, so since I’m in the muscle building business, I’m definitely in that higher range.

Molly Patrick: Okay. And then do you have, same question. “Do you have any workout suggestions for perimenopausal women who are seeing a decline in muscle mass and who may have been slack with strength training in the last year?” Yeah. So let’s talk about like people who are seeing a decline in muscle mass and this person is perimenopausal. Again, I mean, I feel like you kind of covered this already, but do you just want to do a little recap for that?

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, so the thing is that after the age of 35, we lose muscle mass, I think I can’t remember the exact number, I think it was up to 5% of muscle mass per decade that we age, 5 to 10% of our muscle mass package that we age. So it’s not a problem that actually starts with perimenopause, but it starts way earlier. So the way to do it is to really counteract that with specifically doing strength training and for strength training, like, I mean, lifting heavy shit and no, if you lift heavy shit.

Molly Patrick: Mm.

Sarah Diederich: So yeah, basically if you have a decrease in muscle mass, really do everything that you can to counteract that because you just kind of, apart from the importance of your muscle to be mobile and just flexible in your age, resistance training is also very important for your bone density, for example. And that’s something that a lot of people neglect also as you get older, especially women often have the problem of osteoporosis, for example, or of just low bone mineral density.

and that is way more severe in women. So again, the way to counteract it is just engaging in weightlifting. And it doesn’t matter whether you prefer doing peck squats or leg press or whatever it is, just lift heavy stuff that feels good to you and counteract it all you can because there are so many benefits of just being strong, having strong bones as well as your age. And that is again, not a problem that starts in perimonitors but actually way earlier.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Yeah, very good. Great point there. And let’s talk about like heavy shit and what it means because heavy shit for you is going to be different than heavy shit for me. I can tell you that. And so we all, you know, I talk about this a lot. Like we all have to meet ourselves where we’re at. And like if we’re just starting out, we’re going to be lifting not as heavy as when we’re further on in our like lifting journey. I know when I when I first started

Sarah Diederich: Okay.

Molly Patrick: lifting weights, I actually had a personal trainer and I told her, “Look, I don’t want my butt to be flat and I don’t want this like flap right here when I stir, when I’m cooking and when I’m like stirring soup. And so can we, you know, get that in touch and, know, can get that worked out.” And so I started training with her and, but then it turned into something way more like, like I’m doing, I’m going to do this for the rest of my life because I want to age well. Like I want my…

bones to be strong. I want to keep my muscle. But when I started, when I was doing bicep curls with eight pounds, how many kilograms is that? I know that… Okay, so when I was doing that, that was like, and doing like three reps of whatever, that was hard for me. And I’m doing stronger now, but can you talk a little bit about that and like…

Sarah Diederich: That should be roughly 3.5 kg, I think.

Sarah Diederich: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: What is like, people should be challenging themselves, but not trying to do stuff that they’re not ready for, right? That’s basically what I want to talk about.

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, so when I say lift heavy shit, by that I mean lift stuff that is challenging for you specifically, and that really depends on why you start. So if you are like, when I started lifting for the first time, obviously I didn’t shoulder press the amount of weights that I shoulder press today, but you have to kind of progressively overload your muscles. So that means that in order to do that, pick weights that you can lift for a certain rep range that you set yourself. So let’s say

10 to 12 reps, you want to hit 10 to 12 reps on your bicycles. If you can do this with eight pounds, let’s say on three sets, great. Then that means your muscles are ready for the next challenge. Then increase to 10 pounds on the next workout that you have to kind of, again, get the amounts of reps in. And obviously then you might see, “Okay, now I’m not hitting my 12 reps in every set, but only like 10 reps in every set.” So then kind of progress if you work up to that upper range of…

that you have set yourself and then you can increase the weights again. So when I say lift heavy shit, I mean lift stuff that is challenging to you, that kind of forces your muscle to adapt and these adaptations can happen in several ways. So either you increase the reps that you use. So for example, let’s say you work out at home, you only have eight KG dumbbells or eight pound dumbbells. Then you obviously can’t increase the weights that you use, but then you can increase the amounts of reps that you use, for example. So your muscle gets more more fatigued.

And that is also a great way of kind of progress with the overload to really challenge your muscle over and over and over again such as build something up.

Molly Patrick: Okay, great, yes. So meet yourself where you’re at and have it be challenging and then up the weights when you can, right? And because I see a lot of people who go to my class and I’ve been going to this class for like a year and a half and not to give any shame and no judgment, but I see people lifting the same weights for like, you know, and it’s, you know.

It’s hard to lift heavy shit. It’s hard to like get out of your comfort zone and do it. What my coach says is like, she is a fan of like drop, I think she calls it drop lifting. So start out with something a little bit heavier. And if you can’t do it, then you you go down in weight and finish it how you can. So that’s, that was helpful. Yeah.

Sarah Diederich: Dropsets?

Sarah Diederich: Yeah. And something that I also just thought about is don’t do ego lifting. So ego lifting is like, I think it is more of a gym bro thing that they kind of take super heavy dumbbells because they kind of want to prove to themselves that they can lift them. But if your form is way off, you will also not challenge your muscles. So in the end, you won’t grow muscle as effectively as if you had, you know,

Molly Patrick: Mm.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: slow reps and just controlled movements with a little bit lower weights. And I get the appeal of, you know, wanting to lift as much as the gym bro next to you. So I totally get that, that your ego kind of wants to do that. But if you can’t do it properly, it’s not optimal for muscle growth, let’s say.

Molly Patrick: Yes, and you don’t want to hurt yourself. I’ve always appreciated coaches who really focus on form over as heavy as you can. Because there’s some exercises that still, if I’m going to do it properly, I have to go with five pound weights, if I’m really going to do the full exercise. And yeah, I could do heavier, but then I’m not doing it right, and so I’m ultimately not getting as much out of it.

Sarah Diederich: End that.

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, and you’re also probably not targeting the right muscles. So for example, if you do lateral raises, if you do them slow and controlled, they will hit your delt. But if you kind of use momentum and slap your arms like a bird, then it will rather hit your upper traps. And that’s not what we want to do with lateral raises. So you kind of missed the point of the exercise.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Right.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Great point. Okay. Love this. Okay, we talked about this. “For postmenopausal women, is there a time window to have protein after working out? I’ve heard a variety of timeframes. I just want to lift and eat for maximum benefit.” And we talked about this. You are hungry after your workout, so you eat then, but if you want to wait a little while, then okay. No problem.

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, so I wouldn’t say like wait for five hours, you should eat at some point, but I also get that you don’t want to eat right away. But there’s not this anabolic window. That is what is really important to me. There’s not this one specific one hour. And if you miss out on that, then everything will be lost and everything will be to waste. So that is not happening. But just also to fuel your body and support recovery best, eat something a little while after your workout.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Okay.

Molly Patrick: Okay, fair enough. Let’s see. Somebody says, “How do you get enough protein?” And then she said, “Just kidding.” Let’s see. Yes. Yes. My community knows better. I’ve been, yeah, we’ve been talking about protein a lot. It goes in cycles, you know, like, it seems like every, like I’ve been in the plant-based world, like my entire career, and I’m like, I’m 45 now. And

Sarah Diederich: My God.

Molly Patrick: It seems like every few years, like the protein thing comes up and then it dies down a little bit and then it comes up, but we’re in a time where it’s really coming up a lot. And I just saw that Pop Tarts, which is like this very, you know, very overly processed cereal thing here in the US where you put it in the toaster and it’s like, it’s not good, but it’s popular. They just rebranded to do like high protein Pop Tarts, which is ridiculous because it’s still really overly processed food, but they’re such a…

an emphasis on protein right now. And so, you know, I’ve seen it go through these waves and every time it’s like, “Okay, let’s bust out the, you know, the information.” So we’re talking to people who definitely know that where we, where we can get our protein from and that is plants. Okay. So, this is a great question. “What other activities do you regularly do like stretching, yoga, aerobic, and how important are those in addition to weightlifting?” And I actually had this question and wanted to talk about

stretching and the importance or not of stretching after or before or on a daily basis. So what do you say about that?

Sarah Diederich: So I would like something that is actually very beneficial is foam rolling, for example. So there has recently been a study, for example, that shows that foam rolling after a weightlifting session can really prevent also dumps. So just muscle, muscle soreness. So foam running is a great way to to recover after work, for example, but also stretching it might prevent some gap, maybe not soreness, but also some stiffness and stretching also just generally recommend to people to do that.

regardless of their workouts to just stay flexible, especially since we also have, or many people have a job where they’re kind of in shrimp mode all day, every day. So it is also just important in the evening, maybe to open up your thorax again, to kind of open up your chest, your shoulders, to keep everything flexible and not have any shortages or shortenings in your muscle and your ligaments. But that is not, let’s say, workout specific. So stretching is something I would actually recommend to everyone.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: yoga, so some sort of awesome mobility training is very beneficial. The great thing about weightlifting is that a lot of people have the misconception that weightlifting will actually make you less flexible, but that has shown not to be the case. It’s kind of the contrary that weightlifting actually makes you flexible because you also force your body kind of to use the full range of motion with weights. So you kind of really already have that flexibility training, let’s say in weightlifting. But when it comes to really

Molly Patrick: Mm.

Sarah Diederich: preventing soreness, example, I would rather go with foam roller than with stretching, stretching specifically. And one thing that also a lot of people I think get wrong is that when they have sore muscles that they want to stretch, however, because it feels good, obviously. However, when you are sore, you should rather not stretch your muscles too much because soreness actually means that you have small injuries in a muscle and stretching can even further enhance them, let’s say. So your soreness might actually even be delayed and take even longer to kind of

Molly Patrick: Hmm.

Sarah Diederich: away again. I know it feels good, but don’t do it. Rather go for the front roller.

Molly Patrick: Interesting. Okay. And so do you think that there’s, is there a benefit then to stretching before a workout or just waiting until you’re not sore and then stretching? Or do you think it doesn’t really matter? Like as long as you’re getting it in and you’re not doing it when you’re super sore.

Sarah Diederich: Again, I would say it really depends on your goals and on your preferences. So for example, I do think that for example, a little bit of mobility training before you do heavy squats, for example, might be beneficial because you get your hips ready, get your ankles ready. However, if you overdo it, you might again already be fatiguing your muscles to some degree and you can’t lift as heavy as you usually would. So it depends on lift. If you do some heavy compound movements like squats, don’t overdo it, of like get a little bit of flexibility in, but maybe keep the stretching until later.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Okay, okay, great. So can we talk real quick about cardio? I know that you used to do a lot of cardio and you don’t, I don’t know if you don’t do any or don’t do as much. I personally really dislike cardio. I mean, I’ve never, running to me is like, it’s, ugh.

Sarah Diederich: Give the dick.

Molly Patrick: It’s like, don’t, yeah, no, that’s like hell for me. I don’t wanna run. I don’t like doing a lot of cardio. So can we talk about that and your opinions on that and where you’re at with that?

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, so.

So cardio is very important obviously for our cardiovascular health, but I think a lot of people also misunderstand what cardio means. So you don’t have to run two hours twice a week. So you don’t have to do running, you don’t have to do cycling, whatever it is. You can also go for a heavy hike, for example, or just some inclined walking, for example, can also be cardio because it you at a higher heart rate. So you actually get all of the benefits from that as well.

And you also don’t need to overdo it. Regularly or generally what I recommend my clients is that they get in two hours, sorry, two sessions of 30 minutes of cardio at least a week. And again, it also still also depends on their general activity level. So for example, if you’re a person that walks a lot and gets, I don’t know, 10K steps every day, you might not have that many benefits from hitting yet another cardio session, for example. So one thing that I’m also very

Molly Patrick: Hmm.

Sarah Diederich: demand on is that I don’t want to create any negative associations with sports. So if a client for example absolutely despises running, I will never ever in a million years make them run because I don’t want to create any negativity to sports because that is when people start loading it and kind of stop doing sports overall. So if you’re not into cardio, yes, like is it optimal for you to also include cardio? Obviously yes, but if it’s something you absolutely hate,

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Yeah.

Sarah Diederich: maybe you can also survive without it and rather go on a faster walk or a small hike or whatever it is to kind of still get your heart rate up a bit.

Molly Patrick: Okay, yeah, I like that. I do go walking like most mornings and go for at least a half an hour and try to do it at a pace that is not like just a little stroll. And that to me, like it feels good. That’s doable for me. I like it. And like, I just know I’m never gonna run. And I’m happy to hear you say that. I don’t have to. Not gonna do it. Okay, let’s see.

“Is it better to work out before?” Nope, nope, you already answered that one. That’s a lot of questions about the eating schedule and the working out schedule. So we’ve cleared that up. Let’s see. Okay, “I’d love to know how you feel about building muscle without counting, tracking macros.” So we did talk about this and you did say that you don’t count macros. And so do you have anything else that you want to add to that?

Sarah Diederich: I don’t count.

Sarah Diederich: So I 100% support that idea of doing it because if you’re, let’s be honest, if you’re not a bodybuilder, if you’re not a powerlifter that kind of needs to weigh in at a specific weight, for example, you don’t really need it. The precondition on whether you can nourish your body sufficiently for building muscle still is that you have somewhat of an idea. So for example, if you are like my former colleague who thought that corn was a protein source,

you might have a harder time kind of, you know, hitting your macros because if you have very little knowledge about macros in general, it might be harder for you. But if you have a sound knowledge about macros, I a hundred percent am convinced that you can build muscle without tracking everything because again, you’re not a bodybuilder. You don’t need to come in super, super lean. So yes, if you can eyeball it, you’re totally good.

Molly Patrick: Okay.

Sarah Diederich: And I 100% also supported to have a healthier perspective on weightlifting and on sports, because I think the bubble kind of sometimes tends to be a little bit unhealthy and also kind of into a disordered eating pattern direction that I don’t quite like. So really listening to your body and kind of just eyeballing stuff and seeing it from an overall health perspective and fitness perspective, I think is a way better approach than over obsessing about macros and calories.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm. I love that and that was very much in alignment with with how I feel about it and what I talk a lot about so I think it’s a really good a really good reminder. Do you take creatine?

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, I do. So creatine, in my opinion, one of the best supplements you can take if you want to, if you want to build muscle. Again, it is individual. So there is, I think it’s five to 10% of people that are non-responders. So for them, it won’t make any difference. For me, I realized that it made a huge difference in terms of strength in my workouts, because creatine, like basically in a body, it is used to repurchase or refuel your body. So kind of the creatinine is…

TLDR, like you have ATP in your body that is used for energy and kind of creatine helps rebuild these ATP molecules to kind of give your body energy. So that’s what creatine does. And it is one of the most researched or well-researched supplements that you have without any known side effects. So if you want to level up your muscle building journey, absolutely go for it. But then also it’s a question of, you know, how long have you been doing it? So for example, if you’ve been…

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Sarah Diederich: lifting weights for months, is it really necessary? Probably not. But will it do you any harm? Also probably not. So it is a nice add-on, but it is not necessary, let’s say.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and when you said that you saw a difference, you noticed a difference when you started taking it, I’m just curious what that looked like for you.

Sarah Diederich: my weights just went up very fast. So like I really had more energy in the workouts, in the workouts, because I think I just had more energy available in my body. So I realized that my strength was just going up without me having like already built significant more significantly more muscle in like just a few weeks. But just because you have more energy, you can lift heavier. And of course, if you can lift heavier, you challenge your muscle heavier or in a better way. And that means they can just have a better hypertrophy.

Molly Patrick: Okay. Okay.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and when what time during the day do you take creatine and do you take it with food?

Sarah Diederich: It honestly doesn’t depend. It doesn’t matter. So it really depends on like in the morning, for example. I don’t, usually I just take it with my supplements. And since I, for example, also have iron in my supplements, I won’t take it with coffee, for example, because then, you know, that kind of hampers the absorption of iron. But otherwise, take it whenever. And sometimes that’s in the morning, sometimes in the evening. It doesn’t matter at all.

Molly Patrick: Doesn’t matter. Okay.

Molly Patrick: with. Let’s see.

“Postmenopausal and stagnant with lots of pain and no stamina. What would love your take?” So I think also we kind of covered this a little bit, but if somebody was really in that point of like not working out, not having energy, they have some pain and they really have a sedentary life, where do you have them start?

Sarah Diederich: Start slow, really start slow. And that means just bringing some kind of activity back into your daily life. Because I think that’s what a lot of people get wrong. I think they need to do it all right from the start. If, for example, you can manage walks without pain, fantastic. Go for a walk. That is some kind of activity. If you can manage body weight workouts, fantastic. Do body weight workouts. No one says that, you know, you have to throw around some 45 kg plates right away, but really do it step by step.

And as your body also adapts, you might be able also to like endure other things or new things that you weren’t able to endure before. So it is basically just doing whatever you can and not trying to overdo it. And that is always the approach that I take because if you are miserable doing something, it probably won’t benefit you. And if you have pain, that also means that your body somehow apparently needs the recovery or just might have an issue.

And we don’t want to push you over the limit there. So that would benefit you neither physically nor mentally.

Molly Patrick: Okay, so start slow with what they can do and yeah, make sense.

Sarah Diederich: Exactly. And it’s just like with cardio, that is very individual. So for some people, a walk is already cardio, for other people, a marathon is cardio because they are just so well in shape, so it really, really always depends on you.

Molly Patrick: Okay, fabulous. So there’s three more questions here. The first one is, let’s see. “I heard about a protein powder today, Sprout Living Brand, which is supposed to be ground pumpkin seeds only. Would love to hear what she thinks about that.” I haven’t heard of that, but apparently it’s just ground pumpkin seeds.

Sarah Diederich: I have to admit that I don’t know anything about the amino acid profile when it comes to pumpkin seeds. So usually the most protein powders use a blend of soy, pea and rice. Rice protein, for example, sometimes they also have pumpkin seeds. So I mean, if you like it, take it because if it’s high quality protein, absolutely go for it. There is some nuance when it comes to the amino acid profile. So yes.

pumpkin seeds might not have the optimal amino acid profile, let’s say, terms of quantities of leucine compared to the other amino acids, for example. But again, that is detailed. So if you get in sufficient amount of protein over the entire day, I wouldn’t worry about it. And if you like the brand, if you like the protein, if you like the taste, if it’s good quality protein, so usually I recommend that one serving of protein powder should contain at least 20 grams of protein. If that’s the case, perfect, go for it.

Molly Patrick: Okay, great. Okay, so second to last question. “I’d like a straightforward routine for upper body and lower body on alternating days. How do we choose the weight to use? I’m often pretty sore after a simple 15 minute upper body workout. Do we need to warm up and cool down, stretch? Thank you in advance, I’m 75 and strong and want to stay that way.”

“So that was kind of a big question, but I think the basic question here is they want a straightforward upper and lower body workout, which might be kind of hard for you to say because it depends on their body. But how do we choose the weight to use? So that’s kind of interesting. I feel like we kind of talked about that, but what do you have to say about that?”

Sarah Diederich: Yeah, so we want to challenge our muscles. That means that we should go close to failure. However, that doesn’t mean that you really need to go close to failure so that you really can’t do one more rep. But the rep range that is actually working is five to zero reps short of failure, meaning that if you do your last rep, let’s say you do 12 reps and you kind of notice, “Okay, I might be able to do two more.” That is fine.

So that’s the wrap range that you should aim for. That’s called the reps in reserves. If you have reps in reserve, five to zero, that is where muscle growth happens. So that is how you should choose your weights. If you can do that with eight kg dumbbells or eight pound dumbbells, perfect, do that. And as for just the straightforward routine, I would recommend go for compound movements as much as you can, especially if you have shorter workouts, because compound movements just allow you to really cover all of the muscle groups or more muscle groups. Just…

one single or with a few single movements.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and so we talked about, you talked about squats as being a compound movement for lower body and what’s, and shoulder presses as a compound movement for upper body. Do you have any, is that right?

Sarah Diederich: Hmm? Hmm?

Sarah Diederich: It is. So it does also include some of the upper back muscles and the triceps. But for example, I would say that the most common probably compound movements for upper body would be a chest press or dumbbell press, because they really have the pecs, the shoulders and the triceps, or some form of a lat pull down. Or if you don’t work out at the gym, you can also do dumbbell rows, because those will engage like your back muscles, the latissimus, but also the upper back and your biceps as well. So really a big pull movement like

Yeah, a dumbbell roll or let pull down and a big push movement like a dumbbell chest press, for example.

Molly Patrick: Okay, the push and pull thing, yeah. All right, so last question here from the community. She said, “Looking forward to this one, I know older women should be weightlifting for continued bone strength. How much weight, how often? I do yoga and Pilates, but would like to add a weight day.” So I feel like you pretty much covered this, but do you have anything to say to that one?

Sarah Diederich: So first off, yoga and Pilates are great. Please don’t get me wrong when I say that. However, they are not resistance training that will help you actually sustain muscle mass and or build muscle density because for that we really need to kind of challenge our muscles and our bones with heavier weights. That being said, again, do however you can fit it into your schedule. So if you do Pilates and yoga and you can manage one weightlifting session a week, that’s great. That puts you ahead of

probably 99% of society. So do whatever you can. If you want to do it once a week, that’s great. If you can do it twice a week or three times a week, even better. So yeah, usually, as I said, you should try to, for optimal muscle growth, and also to support your bones, to train your muscles two to three times a week so that you have enough recovery time, but that they are also often enough kind of challenge. But if it’s once a week, it’s still better than nothing. So yeah.

Molly Patrick: Okay, and then as far as the how much weight. So that was kind of how often and how much weight. And I know that we, again, we talked about that, because it depends on where they’re at, but it should feel challenging without feeling impossible. Is that paraphrasing okay?

Sarah Diederich: Exactly, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Challenging in the sense that go close to failure, but you need, you don’t need to go absolutely to failure. So if, I don’t know, you do 20 reps with a five pound dumbbell and you could still go for a hundred more reps, then you’re not challenging yourself.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, then maybe up the weight a little bit. Okay, great. So that was, yeah, very comprehensive. A lot of questions, really great answers. Do you feel like we missed any big important things?

Sarah Diederich: Yeah.

Sarah Diederich: There are so many things, if someone asks you for a favorite song and all of a sudden you’re like, “My God, I’ve never listened to a single song in my entire life.” And I’m kind of experiencing that same exact feeling right now. So generally, I would just say every woman profits from lifting weights. Every woman should actually lift weights for their longevity, for their overall health. Because I think longevity is also currently kind of a big topic. And when it comes to longevity, for me, that means living not only long.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes.

Sarah Diederich: but living as well as possible because we want to age as well as possible. And in order to do that, we should actually all live heavy, heavy weights. So that’s one point. And the second point is really not to be scared of lifting weights because I know a lot of people or a lot of women fear that they might get bulky and look like a man all of a sudden, for example, but that really doesn’t happen by accident. So if you don’t want to go for that look, which is totally fine, it won’t happen overnight. But please get into weightlifting because you will only benefit from it.

your energy will go up, muscle, you will have more flexibility, more strength, you will be able to open your pickle jars without asking your husband all the time, for example. So there are so many benefits to it, so get into weightlifting and don’t be scared of getting bulky or looking like a dude or whatever.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, great, great. And you can do it while eating plants.

Sarah Diederich: Anyways, I mean, that is a given. Don’t do it with animal protein.

Molly Patrick: Yes, yes, yes, do it with plants and there’s ways to get enough protein and eat all the yummy delicious things and I just, love it so much because I love to eat. I love to eat, it’s one of the best things and I love to eat. So much fun.

Sarah Diederich: And it’s actually also a great form of activism, I kind of think, because if you are jacked as a vegan, you can show people that it is possible. And they’re like, “My God, you can actually do that on a vegan diet?” And they kind of reflect it, because currently there’s still this stereotype that vegans are skinny and weak and fragile and blah, whatever. I can’t hear it anymore. And that’s just a great way to kind of also promote our lifestyle and promote anti-animal cruelty lifestyle just by…

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Mm-hmm.

Molly Patrick: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Molly Patrick: Yes.

Sarah Diederich: being you and being being an example to other people. So get jacked.

Molly Patrick: Yes, yeah, love it. Okay, well, Sarah, thank you so much. That was fantastic. I really appreciate your time. Where can people find you if they want to learn more, if they want to work with you, if they want to follow you? Where do they go?

Sarah Diederich: So currently I’m only on Instagram as we said under my handle vegansara. My website is still under construction. I was hoping to get it done by November, but we’ll see. And that would be then vegansara.com. However, until then it’s my Instagram and there’s all of the information that you need.

Molly Patrick: Okay, yeah, and we’ll link that in the show notes. So thank you again. Love it. Thanks for pivoting your whole career to do this. I think that this is just such an inspiring life that you are leading and I wish you all the very, best.

Sarah Diederich: Thank you so much for having me and thank you for everything.

Molly Patrick: You got it. Okay. Bye.

Sarah Diederich: Bye bye.